226. Penis Lawyers

AlexThis is Do By Friday, a weekly challenge podcast. This week's challenge, hypnotize yourself.

How do we start? How's the show start? How's the show start? The show starts with me saying how much I appreciate you.

MerlinOh, thank you. I love you.

AlexDon't make it

MerlinSay it again

AlexOkay

MerlinWe could get another phrase that we use That means that That might mean we're having an affair That's what it feels like Here's what we need Okay, I'm going to make a list We need pet names That only we use for each other We need inside jokes That's some of those And then we're going to need code phrases Alex, what else do we need for you and I to have a fake affair, a para affair, a para affair, a para affair, a para, a paraphilia. What's it called? That's the Kraft ebbing thing.

AlexParaphilia? I, well, I mean...

MerlinWell, like a parasocial relationship that you youths talk about. I'm saying we have a para affair.

AlexA para affair.

MerlinI'm going to do my Friday challenge. I don't know where we'll cut in there, but somewhere, because Alex and I started talking about how we're going to handle recording via Zoom, and then we went to a lot of places, and now that's all just tears and rain that you guys will never hear.

AlexI mean, it could be in the after show. Ooh, ooh, what if we had an accidental home?

MerlinPre-show.

AlexYeah, accidental tech pod.

MerlinWait, no, what? So if you just use the Zoom recording of what we talked about, that would be great.

AlexYeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. Mm-hmm.

MerlinAll right. Well, fuck it. Let's do it live.

AlexDoing it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Straight to tape.

MerlinWhat is it? Fuck it. We're doing it live?

AlexYeah, yeah.

MerlinDo it live. That was referenced on EPM.

AlexWell, I got kind of bored with the guy.

MerlinThe guy? I mean, no, no, no. Listen, I'm not being that guy. I'm not being all chap over here.

Speaker ABut also, you know, it was the way he sounded and what he was saying and everything. It kind of became this sound quality.

Merlinkind of I listen I mean I made it up to the talking about predicted part so I must like it Starley's funny on that episode and when John pulls out his beard comb how cute is that his vitiligo oh yeah no it's just funny because he started mentioning it every episode I know I don't know why so he can't dye his beard with was tea how is he gonna dye his beard yeah I think

Alexit was yeah it was packets of tea isn't that gonna make it yellow hi oh i love them so much welcome to dubai friday where we talk about podcasts we like

Merlinyep oh you know maybe we should get like an official all the things to quote mash all the things to get our official okie-dokie.

AlexWell, well, here's a question.

MerlinYes, you there.

AlexDo we include another program you do called Reconcireable... Let's just call it

Speaker ARectifs. That's the member episode.

AlexRectif.

Speaker ARectif.

AlexBlaze it. Does that get the stamp?

MerlinThat character is called, That character you just invented is called 420 Yoda. Nice.

AlexFloaty I am.

MerlinEver think about your hands, have you? So go ahead. So other show, Reconcilable Differences, is that included in the Pantheon, you think?

AlexYes. I've just noticed because I think I'm caught up that our program, this one here is, is kind of brought up somewhat often.

MerlinOh my God. It comes up. And this is besides all the text messages you never see. You would not believe the text messages I get about you. Oh, or sometimes about Roderick where it's like, he'll send me, he'll send me a one second clip of Roderick and just with the word Dave. And I go, yep, he's really become his father. It'll just be him going like, you know, like whatever, like horse radish. And you're like, oh, wow, he really does sound like his dad. You, though, I am sent many links to pursue about goat fronting and challenges.

And he's absolutely gobsmacked when people can't hear the difference between the Dons and Dons of the world.

AlexI think that's like, oh, you know what? It's because he's an East Coast elite. I mean, I'm a third Coastal lead, but it's, yeah.

MerlinThat's part of it. That's part of it, but it's also he's a fellow super taster. He's a superhero. He's a super seer.

AlexWell, I think for context, we should say that your worst best friend, John Syracuse, has been having some, what I would actually say is disordered eating in that he is having, I mean, no, it's not.

MerlinMy disordered eating. My disordered eating. No, no. No, he's slightly disordered. He's got a shitty team-related eating disorders.

AlexOh, I felt that episode real hard.

MerlinI hope I didn't pursue that too hard, but I think someone needs to say to him that it's not healthy or okay to say you can't go leave and eat for a while.

AlexYeah.

MerlinThat's the worst kind of power. I used to think this in the mid-'90s when people started getting cell phones, cellular phones as we used to call them. And we go out to lunch and there'd be some douchebag talking on his phone at lunch at the next table at the all you can eat sushi place we went to. Really good sushi. And I would say, you know, and I did a bit about this for a thing I wrote for. It's like you have enough power to be given a phone, but you lack the power to have lunch without doing work. That's a really bad combination.

That means they gave you that phone for reasons that are not a compliment.

AlexYeah. Yep. especially when you have when your manager

MerlinThis is a safe space, supposedly.

AlexI mean, well, this is a thing.

MerlinNot for everybody, but...

AlexI don't feel safe.

MerlinSome are safer here than others. It's not safe for anybody who's ever hosted the show, but there's a lot of people who want to make it safe for them.

Speaker AOh, God.

Merlinhere's the thing that makes that disordered in my opinion is like it's one thing oh god there's so many fucking levels to this what we're talking about is john talking about how his eating has become strange during covid because he has to do work at home and family's home sometimes but you know but because of his man the management aspects of his work that he needs to be available and this is all on top of no matter when, how early he starts talking to their, you know,

West Asian programmers at five in the morning, he's still expected to be around when everybody else is working. So even though his work is done between seven and three, mostly, he's still kind of expected if somebody drops something on his fucking outlook, he's expected to be at a meeting at 4.30 and it's like, well, and then on top of it all, the eating part, and this is not to joke. I mean, I'm not trying to joke about eating disorders, but I think that's why I like, when you say something like anorexia or bulimia, That's a special sort of term of art. But I think a lot of us have fucked up eating that is so based in emotion and disruption and expectations and control.

Like first thing I knew about with eating disorders was control. The first person I knew with an eating disorder, and I didn't realize it until I was in my 30s probably, was my grandmother. The way that she would exercise control over my colonialist domineering grandfather was to be slow and late for everything, including like when she started eating, when she finished eating. You ever meet those, especially women, who like always have to do extra stuff to their food and take it to the kitchen and heat it up and it becomes a drama, like low-key drama thing but not big enough to notice? Like that is a form of disordered eating.

And so when John Craig Syracuse, who's been working and talking to people since, you know, very early in the morning, he can't just go somewhere and eat lunch. Like he's expected – so he's expected to be available but then you know it's bad because now he feels like he has to be available. and now you know you're watching the watcher it's it's become so fucked up that now you're fucking yourself up because you think it's the right thing to do and that seems very not wholesome

Alexto me yeah i never thought i'd be the kind of person who would eat in my bedroom not not necessarily because it's bad but you know i like boundaries you want ants do you want i know this is why we can't have nice things and because that's how we get ants somebody left their plate

Merlinout two nights ago and the sugar ants found it just fyi okay anyway why are you eating your room

Alexsometimes uh oh well this is the same thing i needed to be quote on call because i'm a surgeon uh apparently but the i mean it's when you have a very large office it's also hard to set those boundaries because sure there's a kitchen but it's like are you working in the kitchen or are you at your desk and like are you if you're eating at your desk are you working or i couldn't have a

Merlinjob like that i couldn't have a job like that i don't want to have to interact lightly with that many people all the time it's like always being on a human subway just always somebody's dick brushing up against you it's like can you all just take two giant steps back and act like i'm not here like i mean i'm so anti-social and introverted in that way like i just never understood i think I told you this story at one point when I was first looking for an office. I'd looked at a bunch of places and I think it was Noah.

AlexAnd used Evernote when it was good.

MerlinI used it when it was good. It was the most successful Evernote project ever. But I think it was maybe even Noah at Twitter that was like, hey, you know, we got this new office in South Park. You know, people are renting desks here if you want to work here. I was like, that'd be kind of cool. So far away from where I am, especially compared to where I ended up. But like I remember going in there and like everybody, especially the like the most of the worker bees were at the equivalent of picnic tables in the main room. So if you imagine. So imagine like like a Hogwarts. Oh, no. Oh, no. Oh, that's where you're working. That's where you're working.

AlexAnd it's not worse than I thought. Oh, no. And it's not wizard snow.

Merlinlike it's just it's a giant giant wooden and concrete room with people sitting at long long tables oh for aesthetics i mean you know the open plan kind of thing i guess and so the one that was offered to me would be upstairs in a more isolated area but like still in like up you're in the

Alextwitter building there's no i can well i can imagine that there's uh at least now there's

Merlinvery little isolation every few months everybody comes over and yells at you for a day then disappears um but you know and it's all like you know cool people i'm like i love that group that was that i don't know anybody that works there now i don't i think my friend steven works there and that's about it but i knew all the founders and all the original employees i met jack did you get on bitcoin uh hey pounce on bitcoin no i met jack when he was basically working in a library carol like that's when i first met jack and i knew jack because he had written this amazing

at the time amazing mac os service os 10 service for uh trans basically i think mostly what he'd done he wrapped gruber's script and he wrapped aaron's script but he made a service where you could hit command shift greater than to turn something in to mark down to html command shift less than to try and go back and i did it all the time and so like he walked up to me in the i was there for the audio office and he walks up he goes i'm jack and i'm like oh my god it's so nice to meet you and it's just really nice time simple times but i went up to that second floor this is

years later then this is probably two this would be 2009 probably but i went i go upstairs and it's just like i i really i mean the way i remember in my head and this has got to be a homer simpson memory but i do seem to remember like three different techno songs playing while people threw a ball or a bop it or whatever it just felt like the ultimate silicon valley like overstimulation area of like, I cannot write a book. I'll never write a book, he would say later. But I really super can't write a book while people are listening to Born Slippy or whatever.

AlexYeah. Oh, oh, oh.

MerlinAlthough that's, to be honest, that's a terrible choice for me because that is one of my top five played over and over when I need to concentrate songs.

AlexOh, interesting.

MerlinYeah, you got Everlong. You got that one Wu-Tang song that I like. Yeah, but I'm... That didn't mean your boy. You're the old boy.

AlexDon't come here. You got me on a Foo Fighters kick again.

MerlinOh my God, that album. Oh my God, my poor brain.

Speaker AOh my God, it's such a good record.

MerlinHave you gone back recently and rewatched the live Monkey Ranch video with Kiss Guy?

AlexNo, I've not. God damn it.

MerlinThat's going to be in the after show, which you can listen to by going to giveusyourfuckingmoney.com. And Alex and I will be watching the live version of Monkey Ranch with Kiss Guy. And also, so you get the show. It's always ad-free. We can't do anything about that. No one would want to advertise here. I would want to advertise here.

AlexOh, God. Not even Bluetooth, which I would happily take.

MerlinWhat else do they get? Oh, you can ask Alex where the RSS feed is for free.

AlexYes. Well, yeah. You can ask where the Discord is, which doesn't exist. And I apologize because I just can't remove that apparently. But I highly suggest you go to, oh, I don't know the URL, but there's an amazing Dubai Friday Minecraft server in which a bunch of people have like reconstructed. Just I don't know. It's also like the queerest Minecraft server I've ever seen. Oh, it's so good.

MerlinLet me jump in here. Oh, sorry. So people from the Discord have reassembled in Minecraft.

AlexYeah, yeah. And if you're not into Minecraft, they...

MerlinThat's cool. No, no, I'm not taking them to piss. I'm just asking the question.

AlexYes, yes. Like our buddy, President Joseph Rogan. You're just curious. You just want to know if... Oh, sure, because you're so open-minded. Yeah, yeah.

MerlinWe should start a law firm, you and me. I just hear that phrase, expect to be my friend's penis lawyer. I think you and I should become, you know, officially start getting paid to be lawyers for our friends. we're going to be lawyers. We're going to be sin eaters. We're going to be explainers, enablers, codependers.

AlexUh-huh.

MerlinBut mainly you're penis lawyers.

AlexI mean, well.

MerlinPlease defend your friend's penis. No. I didn't go to law school to do this. I'll allow it.

AlexI recently met a wonderful CPA that I can interact with. But God, I and I'm like in the waters of almost like adulthood. But if I ever have to interact with a lawyer, I don't know what like I.

MerlinLawyers can be very funny. They can be very funny.

AlexI mean, well, like, ha ha, you're going to jail funny or your money's gone. Like, I don't know. No, this isn't even like.

MerlinWhat is going to happen with the president? if this if those ding-a-lings and I don't mean to get all fucking MSNBC here but I did I was not watching it yesterday when it was happening so here I'm talking about the impeachment trial Jamie Raskin came out and gave a speech that you'll be reading about and listening to for years did you watch his whole speech? No well did you watch the end like where he gets to the end? No it's incredibly well I mean long story short everybody's seen it but basically at the end of this really really good presentation

where they showed this stunning like heavily edited why didn't the defense do this because they have no money and don't know how to use Abbott I guess 13 minute video highlighting what happened and a timeline that easily juxtaposes shit Trump said that's then immediately echoed by the chuds who are like you know cutting off cops fingers or whatever and it was really effective and then at the end as everybody has probably heard he closes very emotionally so here's a little bit of Jamie Raskin timeline, his son took his own life and was buried the day before the insurrection.

My gosh. Yeah. And so like his youngest daughter didn't want him to be alone on that day and came with him to the capital. Also came along, his older daughter's husband came along. So he had family there that day. And when the shit went down, he was separated from them. So they sheltered separately. his youngest daughter and and his son-in-law uh not not that her husband but anyway you get the idea and so basically he's just he's up there and he's you can just feel i think the phrase he used

that was on top of all the very affecting things that he said in a very you know sober way was that democracy is very personal it's democracy is ultimately very personal and you i think probably understand that in a way that maybe even I never will, that like this means a lot more than like, you know, the pictures of the presidents on the wall or the constitution you keep in your vest or whatever. That was pretty funny. There's something extremely personal about what we're talking about

here. And if you, you know, you could say that this is meant to be like dramatic or whatever, but like those people fear for their lives. I mean, if you really, if you see here where they can hear the pounding Nancy Pelosi on 60 Minutes showing this is the debt this is the table that all my staff hid under while people pounded on the door outside and had they had to just sit there and like you know you can you know if you're if you if you don't get that you're not wired right and for him like just to say the other thing where he really lost it just about was saying

he said when he's reunited with his daughter and son-in-law he said something like you know you know it's not it won't be like this again he told them it'll be safe of course it'll be safe it's the capital it's one of those protected places in the world and then afterwards he said it won't be like this next time and she said i don't want to come back to the capital and he broke down and sobbed a little bit because his son just died his son just got buried now his daughter like is scared to go to the united states capital talk about a fucking bad week

and he turned it into such an effective and affecting and let's be clear here he's not just doing this for clapping he's not just trying to do some hallmark thing he made a very lucid well argued case about why why this impeachment needs to happen i still continue to mostly not agree but he made he made the case great and but then he his closer really grounded it in an american's heart and in a way that i found pretty profound and then a door opened on a tiny car and thousands

of clowns came out all representing the president apparently according to him according to molly haberman he was basically yelling at his tv through most of both of the lawyers talking because at this point at this point he could get he could get better attorneys out or out of a box of Cracker Jack.

AlexI have tried. It's probably true.

MerlinOne of his lawyers sued him last year.

AlexIt was so funny.

MerlinDid you know that? Did you know of his three lawyers? His ding-a-ling seventh round of lawyers that he's got now. One of his attorneys sued him last year.

AlexOh, it's wonderful. It's not, you would say, I think, it's not wholesome necessarily to really get into the shot for all out of German word.

MerlinIt's not, it's not, it's not that, you're okay to take a hit of that. You're okay to wheeze that juice, take a quick one hitter, a schadenfreude sometimes. But boy, once you start making that, yeah, we don't want to do that. But I'll allow it.

AlexWell, well, that's the thing though. I think there's a difference between that and having some sort of, I guess, satisfaction in knowing that people in power are getting a little taste of what normal people have to have anxiety about. Yes.

MerlinThere's a million ways to phrase this that are as stupid as they sound. So when we say stuff like, wow, sauce for the gander, or now you know how it feels, or there's all these different things that are like, you know, decisions have consequences and all those kinds of things. I mean, but I think the part about this, to call it satisfying, would be too schadenfreude, but there's something, there is something slightly gratifying about going, well, you know, everybody else in America throws a Frisbee in the air and it falls down. And there's one person in America who seems to like throw any number of Frisbees that he wants

and they never hit the ground. Matt and I were talking about this last night, just how crazy it is that like, as everybody is aware now, Trump is the only guy in America that gets away with a bunch of shit and his little lackeys don't. But what's wild about it is that like there is something, And obviously you go like, oh, like how can you – but you can tell he's so unhappy because even when he's quote unquote winning and by winning I mean not strictly losing technically, he's never happy because he didn't like the way that he won and he didn't like that he's not getting enough credit for how he won. Even though the ways that he wins are like just improbably, for any adult in America, improbably not based in any kind of reality and are based totally in the worst kind of respect or fear that one could ever hope to have.

and none of it is making him happy, which does give me a small amount, just a little tiny light orange glow, kind of like the glow of the juice in my clear body that cleans out all of my bad self-confidence, kind of like that juice.

AlexOh, okay. Oh, I see what you did there.

MerlinBut, and again, just to clarify, this is why everyone needs to get off Twitter. Woof. Oh my God. It's not getting better, Alex. It's not getting better.

AlexWell, I have been on Twitter a bit more. And then, like you, I seem to gain followers whenever I don't tweet.

MerlinIt's always been true. Always been true. Kane, just mute me. I muted you guys. Just mute me. Oh, yes, please. I don't hurt a fellow's feelings.

AlexI mean. Mute me. Mute me. wednesday adams just like just mute but i had a sort of a very upsetting feel i i i don't know quite how to describe it but when all of the like the parlor fucks were banned from twitter it's not like i lost i definitely lost like a hundred followers which i normally never uh i

MerlinI think a thing happens where like there's a kind of like, oh, I've got my eye on you kind of thing that happens. And I usually do the soft block when I see that.

AlexYeah. And I know that. But yeah. Yeah.

MerlinIf I get like if I get flag tie dad suddenly following me, flag tie dad with the seven followers and I'll just be like, oh, block on block. Bye.

Alexhave you ever been added to a list that was clearly intended to be private and

Merlinyeah i mean there's like it's well you'll see you get added to the list of like you know

Alexwow human bags of meat that should die 2021 yeah yeah uh i i am uh i i this was a big year to be for me to be added to.

MerlinOh, nice.

AlexYesterday I was added to a couple Joe Rogan lists. Oh, gosh, I think they're private now.

MerlinOh, Alex.

AlexWait, why?

MerlinYour account on Twitter.com was added to, quote, some Joe Rogan lists.

AlexOh, like his fucking shots. Is that what you're saying? Yeah, yeah. It was, I was added to Sheeple 2020, which is outdated. and bitches, which is my favorite.

MerlinWell, there you go.

AlexNormally I just get gay slurs. I was a little, I'm like, oh, I'm sorry.

MerlinGay slurs. Oh, gay slurs. Yeah. Here's one for you, Syracuse. Hi, I'm Marsha Gay slurs. Marshall and Marsha Gay slurs.

Ah, challenge.

AlexDig, dig, dig, dig, dig.

MerlinChallenge this week is, I think it was maybe Alex's? I was kind of, it might be technically mine, but the genesis was yours and I don't remember how. The, my understanding of the challenge this week was to hypnotize yourself.

AlexMm-hmm. And, oh, I'm just very upset about this whole thing. Would you?

Merlinself-hypnosis. All right. I don't know how far we're going to dig into any of this, but like, there's so much. Well, okay. So, but I think, I think one way to give that we can go any direction you would like, but I think one way to give this a little bit of focus is that one reason I jumped into hell. Yeah. I would do a self-hypnosis challenge. As I mentioned, I believe in the after show. Yeah. It must've been the after show last week. I said, you know, I actually had two different phases where I was into self-hypnosis. So hell yes, I've already done the challenge. I'd be happy to do it again.

But further to that, first time I did this was in about eighth grade with a book. And the second time was when I bought a cassette tape at a flea market for doing self-hypnosis.

AlexWait, hold up. A self-hypnosis book? How does that work?

MerlinLook at the doc and scroll down. Because I found it this morning.

AlexOh, is this like a magic eye? Did you just look at this?

MerlinIt's one of those, I think it's a pretty classic 70s optical illusion. Would you like to read the cover? The thing is, we could also, maybe in the after show, we could take a tour of the many different covers that this book has had over the years. Oh, my God. Because it's interesting how much it reflects the Journey of America title.

Speaker AWould you like to read this to our listeners?

MerlinWhat we're looking at here is a paperback book that I acquired in about 1981, probably, with this cover. and it's almost in like an impact kind of font.

AlexYes. Wow. Let's go.

MerlinWhy don't you go and read the copy?

AlexStop smoking.

MerlinSignet $1.75.

AlexOh, I apologize. Signet $4.75.

MerlinNo, no. No, no. Okay. Okay. Escape, escape. Let's pick it back up. Let's reset to one. Let's pick it back up with stop smoking.

AlexStop smoking. Ellipses.

MerlinEllipses.

AlexLose weight. a lip well actually uh lose weight dot dot dot uh in in slightly a slightly smaller font type face whatever shed your inhibitions through the power of your own inner mind inner mind and then a gigantic i should say this the text beforehand was a like poopy pumpkin green i don't know if that is just from age or uh is that bacon john's brother

Merlinhe has two nicknames and no first name is in quotes poopy in quotes pumpkin last name green self and it's not just so we're clear it's not self-hypnosis it's self-hypnotism correct the next line the technique and its use in daily living by leslie m lacron clinical psychologist and then a picture of an optical illusion

Alexyep which i don't but what is this alluding to i know it's not the worst thing don't tweet at me

Merlinwhat oh my god you've got to chill green i am just i hate this whole thing i hate this challenge i don't know why i suggested it whoa whoa okay all right so this is the paperback book i got Probably a Walden book. Speckman was just called Walden. Oh, yeah. And so I bought this book. And it does have one of the things I found useful in this. We can get to why I did this and how it worked at the time or whether it worked. It didn't, but it did. It worked, but not in the way you expected. Hi, I'm Malcolm Gladwell.

AlexOh, you're sneaking back to work episodes in here. You got, okay, we got rec diffs.

MerlinWe talked to a boob fighters. All right, all right.

AlexWe got a Roderick. You got a –

MerlinDawn and Dawn.

AlexGoat running.

MerlinTodd Vaziri's on wire.

AlexThe Johns, the Dan's.

MerlinDogs and cats living together.

AlexWe're going to talk about Mark Cuban later. Anyway, hypnosis.

MerlinNo. So self-hypnotism. One of the things I found useful in this book, this is from phase one, which would be when I was in eighth grade circa 1981. But it's pretty wackadoo, right? I think this book very much comes out of the 70s. And so it has stuff like what we would now think of. Oh, and please, will you capture this? I want to talk about the distinction between meditation, relaxation, hypnotism. I want to talk about what those things mean. because I think it's important. You were talking about it, and I think we should talk about that. But one of the big foci of this book

is learning to use, I forget the name for this, but it's basically the equivalent of like a Ouija board, but it's a pendulum. So you hang something off the end of a string, and you hold it this certain way over a piece of paper, and you've told yourself when it moves horizontally, it means this. When it means vertically, it means this. When it moves in a circle, it means this. When it moves in a counterclockwise circle, it means that. And this supposedly enables you to ask questions to your inner mind and then have it respond to you by making the pendulum move.

This is a book that I read in 8th grade.

AlexOh, that...

MerlinWould you want to try that? Would you want to put like a fishing lure on the end of some monofilament and ask yourself questions about your inner mind?

AlexYeah, well that's in 8th grade. Oh, absolutely. I would have been like, oh, I am down for this. I am actually... Sure. Just like doing your own

Merlinslam book on yourself. Yeah. Yeah.

AlexGeaslers. Wait.

MerlinThe Geaslers.

AlexI was not doing those things in ninth grade. Capital school. But so you said this didn't work, but it did? What now?

MerlinWell, yeah. Let's get to that. Let me get that through the other part. Then the second part, and this is where it becomes important for Alexandra, I think, is then I don't know how this happened, but because I didn't have a lot of dough and I didn't even go to the flea market very much. It was in a different county. But I was at the Wagon Wheel Flea Market and I saw, you know, those places that sell cassettes. And one of those places had a bunch of self-help cassettes. And so I purchased with my busboy money probably, I purchased a cassette tape.

And I have done a little bit of, you know, not research, but looking up. I purchased from a company called Potentials Unlimited is the publisher of this. It's called Self-Confidence, Guided Meditation, Self-Hypnosis, Subliminal Self-Confidence. It's by Potentials Unlimited. And I learned last week it's done by a fellow whose voice I have heard for hours and hours and hours since 1984, a guy named Barry Konikov, which you can see in the header of our document here.

There's Barry. He definitely looks like a hypnotist. That's your tape. That's your tape that you listen to.

AlexBut is this, are all four, oh, they're all the same guy. I thought.

MerlinThese are the four berries you meet in heaven.

Hello, greetings, and welcome. Welcome to a new beginning for if ever in your life. And so here's the thing. You get this tape, it's a 34, 35 minute tape that you play. and the idea of it is if you have a problem with self-confidence, self-worth,

Speaker AI can't recite the whole thing.

MerlinYou listen to this and enter into a state of self-hypnosis. From this point forward, this is never to be played in a moving automobile or at any time for that matter when you would like to maintain complete consciousness. I believe is how it goes, but I'm not sure.

AlexOh, God, my spine just shivered.

MerlinI listened to it more times than Barry requested and it helped me at a time that I was very, very low. And I want to talk about why that is. But here's the thing. So it's a 35-minute tape you listen to. And let me ask you this, Alexander. Did you listen to how much of this? So what I did was I ripped it. I actually finally bought it. When I discovered that it was still fucking available on the internet, I bought the tape as an MP3. And that's what I sent you.

AlexOh, my.

MerlinI've since cleaned up the, because I'm deaf, I've cleaned up the equalizing a little bit. I got a little sharper now.

AlexOh, did you? Is that the one you sent me?

MerlinNo, I sent you the lame one. But I dropped it in a description because I am going to do a super cut of all the good lines from this. And I'd like you to remove as much of your clothing as you're comfortable in doing.

AlexI love it.

MerlinDid you like the mirror?

AlexI, oh, okay.

MerlinIt's a journey. It involves a mirror. It involves writing a letter. And then I think the really big middle part, if you're still awake when this plays, is you get to a part where you're supposed to imagine your body being like clear, like made of glass and this orange liquid entering your body and cleaning out all the negativity.

AlexAll right. So he says, I believe, don't listen to this more than three times in a span of a week. Right. Is that correct?

MerlinWell, according to Barry, here I'm talking about the Potentials Unlimited Hypnosis, Barry Konakoff. Barry says that you should limit your – fuck. What you're supposed to do is listen to this during the day and find yourself seated in your chair, your feet flat on the floor.

AlexOr lying down. Or lying down.

MerlinOr lying. Sitting or lying. Right, right, right, right. And so the idea is you're supposed to listen to this when you're not going to fall asleep and then it's okay at a certain point to listen to it more when you do fall asleep. I probably followed the rules for less than a week, but because I'm super thirsty for self-help, I did then listen to it every night going to bed. And spoiler alert, to this day, it's still something I listen to, even though I'm not hearing. I put it on in the background, all of the shipping forecasts when I want to fall asleep. Because even though I'm not doing,

according to Hoyle's self-hypnosis, I am doing relaxation, which I think this is good for. How far did you get?

AlexI listen. Oh, I don't know if I told you, but last week I was I was very OK. We had a bit of a scare because I got got real sick with what I was like. Oh, the covid. But no, I just got a I had the regular flu because someone forgot to. The nurse is like, did you get a flu shot this year? And I'm like, no, well, last year. Oh, no, I did not. because why would i forgot to get a flu shot and anyway i i just uh i forgot i forgot to post

Merlinreconcilable differences last week so it was a hard week for everybody yeah yeah i literally forgot to post a show till two days later when john sirkusa said um and i went wait don't say another word i spaced it on thursday and now it's saturday you know what though that was an

Alexthank you uh uh no you didn't you didn't forget you waited until your friend alex was conscious enough to listen.

MerlinOh, that was nice of me. I'll tell you a secret also. Yeah, John, come on. Well, I don't like to give him credit for anything because he doesn't deserve it. But he helped a brother out last week. He wrote the description last week. Oh, wow. For the first time. So far, he's contributed. Well, I mean, he makes edits. I'm not allowed to post it until he's running his edits over it. But he's actually, no, no. To his credit, John is incredibly cool about letting me increasingly turn it into obviously my voice in the show notes. But he did a couple or four weeks ago say, editor's note, this is not true,

or this didn't happen, something like that, which made me so happy. But yeah. Then it came out. Now, you thought you had the

Alexflu, you say. So, no, I did have a flu. They said, oh, yes, because I guess the COVID test, like, whatever, you know, I've done the swabby, like, I don't know, like, seven times at this point.

MerlinAnd that's because of the dog walking concerns.

AlexYeah. So, yes.

MerlinOne of Maddie's clients

Alexhad it is that right yeah uh uh hey hey listeners my my spouse just uh is a dog walker is slash podcaster and so they have to occasionally come into contact with people who don't do the mask thing and like uh but and so one of one one of his clients is a um public school teacher and so uh her husband got it she and her husband got it and yeah so that was yeah it's uh but uh they're okay hooray um but i so that that was a whole thing but this uh no it just paid i oh god when

was it was sometime last week and like no no you you have a different viral infection you just uh you should really get your flu shot like i know i'm sorry i haven't like i've less i can count on the number of times i've been outside since march oh my and we wonder why people don't go to the

Merlinfucking doctor oh you should i'm mad at you and i'm yelling at you because you came here for help you finally broke down in my case and came for help but you know it's not fun until you make the patient feel bad about a thing they didn't do yeah and i mean oh fuck a duck god damn it but uh but

Alexyeah everybody get uh your flu shot when you can go outside again um but i yeah i just well and that's the thing maddie got his because like like he he also does um a majority majority pretty much all of the shopping now because it's like well if i'm gonna get something like you know yeah you

Merlingotta break up the tasks why expose everybody when i agree to get exposed for these things you get exposed for those things then you know eventually hopefully we get to live another year

AlexYeah, some.

MerlinSo, so, flu. You had the flu. Anyway, flu. What are we talking about here?

AlexBut he got, okay, so he, all right, I'll go quick. He didn't, he gave me the flu, but I didn't get a flu shot. He did because at Walgreens they were basically like stabbing people like in and out with the flu shot. But so I was like barely conscious for like three days last week, but I listened to this tape, tape, MP3.

MerlinIt was. It started as a tape. My Potentials Unlimited was a cassette tape.

AlexYeah. Well, I've gotten to know Barry quite a bit because I some days listened to it twice. But every single day I listened to this and I still don't know how I feel about it.

MerlinI'm so interested in this.

AlexYeah. I mean, we've both been drawn many times to self-help racket type things for many reasons. And I especially me with like, you know, meditation, because one might say I get anxious sometimes.

MerlinInteresting.

AlexI know. But the first time I listened to it, I'm like, oh, fuck this. And like fell asleep immediately. I didn't get to the I got to the mirror part. And then I think my brain was like it just shut down. It's like, I don't want to imagine. I don't.

MerlinYeah. Think about how you feel about your body, because in the end. Yeah. You have a healthy, attractive body. And if there are things that you would like to change, if you want to change your hair color, do it. If you want to change your style or your clothing, do it.

AlexIf there's something on your body that makes you puke every day because you hate it so much, you can just – don't worry. You got it. You got it.

MerlinWell, like a spigot or something?

AlexYeah. I got some – Oh, that would be so useful. That would be so useful.

MerlinIf you had a spigot. You can open and close at any time. Turn it on, turn it off. I would love that.

AlexOh, indeed.

MerlinI'd like a two-way spigot like a dishwasher. I would like a way to expel things with this spigot, and I would like it to bring things in with maybe something like a human hose. I need a book.

Put it in my human hose.

AlexOh, oh. Oh, all the great hoes. All the great hoes.

I don't think we've mentioned that almost right away. Barry does mention that if you fall asleep, it's OK, but you will still get the benefits if you are.

MerlinYeah, that's definitely bullshit.

AlexYeah.

MerlinThere's a lot of bullshit in this. Doesn't make it bad. Doesn't make it useless. just because something is bullshit doesn't make it useless yes and i'm returned to something here like for example who was i talking to about this talking about heuristics i was talking to somebody on twitter about this oh you know what it was was john chidgy and talking about the scum line um on the water park ride in australia that broke this is this is a show by front of the show john

Alexchidgy who does a really good show are you his penis uh lawyer too who's this okay okay okay if

MerlinThat's some kind of Australian. No, I'm his toe cutter. No, here's the thing. And what I said was, long story short, that's the thing, though. Heuristics are incredibly useful until they're not. Like, you know, if there's this thing that works, as if you like a rule of thumb, and it works over 90% of the time, well, guess what? That works a lot better than a lot of other stuff. Is it perfect? No, and that is really the problem, is there are some heuristics that don't work. And I think there's a lot of stuff that's bullshit, not for the reason one thinks necessarily, but just because something might be bullshit doesn't mean it's not useful.

And I think this is why I argue that John Syracuse said about religion. We'll save it for the show.

AlexOh, oh, oh, okay.

MerlinBecause I think people – there are certain people that have a very stern feeling about that who've really turned a corner on certain kinds of topics in this world. and like the thing is I may cede you the point that the thing that you don't like is kind of bullshit but I will not cede you the point that the thing that you think is bullshit is useless not by a long shot because if you like singing and cover dishes have I got a building for you

AlexI think

Merlinjust doing a remembrance of me am I right oh you're Catholic you wouldn't know that reference okay well

Alexsometimes we intermingled you know

Merlinoh and also with you and now what do you say instead high five what do you say now and also your grace no what do you say now instead of saying and also with you. What do you say now?

AlexAnd with your spirit.

MerlinOh, with your mama. Okay, that's terrible. That's terrible. Stand up, you sit down. You kneel. You stand up, you sit down. What are we doing here? How long does it take to marry two people? It's only two people.

AlexFucking Catholic weddings.

MerlinAt least you get crack.

AlexYou know what? There's a snack in the middle. There's a snack in the middle.

MerlinYou know what I'm really in the mood for is a cracker that's had some hands on it.

AlexUh-huh. Well, you've seen the new dispensers, right?

MerlinNo.

AlexNo? Okay.

MerlinIt's like when you go to McDonald's. Is it like there's an Arfit on your cup?

AlexOh, no. Oh, where is it?

MerlinYeah, here we go. No free refills.

AlexThis is not a library. You appear like you don't have a place to sleep tonight, so no Bord-Eye Coke for you.

MerlinAnd the foyer counts. Don't sleep there either.

AlexAll right.

MerlinStill too close. Ronald is mad at you.

Alexi i have not gone to to mass in in quite a while oh my god alex is this real yeah yeah yeah okay

Merlinfirst of all is this oh my god is this real and second of all how have i never learned about churchsupplies.com doctor oh my wife is about to get so many gifts she won't understand oh oh god

Alexi oh it's they should just say gifts for the heathen in your life oh god that's good oh that's

Merlinso good. You know what I'm saying? It's not really about grace. Grace and confusion. Oh, in fact... That's a great movie. You know what? I'm gonna

Alexdo... This is very

MerlinCatholic. You can get a robe. It's called a slab... slabbing?

AlexSlabbing? Oh, we're on the main side? I'm on popular categories.

MerlinInsert candles. Is that a request? Woof. Oil burning liquid candles, picks, liquid paraffin, and slabbing. So, sorry, continue.

AlexI mean... Hypnosis. Yeah, hypnosis. Oh, we have women's

Merlinclergy shirts oh this will serve me well at sea hello ladies yeah yeah domini domini i god i want

Alexto i want to buy something from this site so bad i still can't get them do you have to show id if

Merlinyou want women's clergy shirt short sleeve tab collar black do you have to show you have to show

Alexclergy id well i i bet you need to do do you have a little sorry um i believe you need to show the your certificate of uh confirmation look at this one look at this one right here i just sent you you can tell she likes a little rough look oh yep yep yep yep oh good lord oh what

Merlinshe's doing with her finger what's she doing with her finger well that oh shit dog yep uh she's been hello greetings and welcome welcome to a new beginning i mean for for a catholic mass

Alexthere's a lot of things you do with your body that you can do with other activities that you just can't help but wonder like it's like physical analogies oh i bet it's i bet it's grooming oh is that what is that is that what's happening oh what like you can wear it like you say to a boy

Merlinlet's swap shirts and he says i should go is that what you're talking about can you wear my purple

Alexmy purple shirt well uh uh no no i'm thinking about grooming like just you know let them brush

Merlinyour rock and roll hair you're saying yeah not that kind of grooming not not yeah not or like

Alexhorses we have to stop soon talk about hypnosis okay all right all right uh uh okay okay so you

Merlindid listen to it what's the part that upsets you i'm curious because is it is it the thinking about

Alexwhat's it you tell me you use mouth words you phrased it perfectly is is it's that i found it very useful, but totally bogus, I guess.

MerlinTotal bullshit, yeah.

AlexYeah, and...

MerlinBecause hypnosis, as I understand it, I mean, hypnosis, I think it's the kind of thing that one can really misunderstand because like gorillas and quicksand, it was something that seemed like there'd be a lot more of it in the future. And hypnosis used to be everywhere. And hypnosis used to be, I'm going to pull this off the dome, but it used to be associated with mesmerism and this idea of being like, or like a Svengali who's able to like cause you to do things or like a very German expressionist, kind of like a Dr. Caligari type situation

where you take people into your multi-angular set and make them do sex things or something. That there is an aspect, and this is also a sex thing. There's a sexy thing about hypnosis, right? But it all comes down to this weird, I don't want to allow myself to be controlled by someone else, especially if I don't know I'm being controlled, I think is the beef with this. When, I mean, and this will, we should talk, let's save it for the after show because I need my break after a while. But this is where it gets into, all right, like what is the difference between, say, self-hypnosis, meditation, relaxation?

And once we get into meditation, is the meditation that one does with an app on your iPhone the same thing as when Jack goes and gets bitten by mosquitoes for a week or whatever? Is that the same thing? I think they're not. It doesn't make any of it useless, but because of the baggage that we bring to these things, we think, oh, it doesn't do what it says on the tin. Nobody ever really printed that on the tin. I don't think anybody ever said that mesmerism was going to be a thing. I think that there's a person named Mesmer who would basically try to control people in this – who am I thinking of?

Rasputin, not Svengali. Rasputin kind of way, right? Like you're going to be able to hypnotize women and make them do sex stuff in your cabinet of Dr. Caligari. or what have you. But here's the thing. If there is a tool that can teach you a way to calm down. Okay. So for me, and I've said this before, it bears repeating. It took me until fairly recently to realize that I think I really confused these symptoms and causes of anxiety. Is it so much?

Certainly if you're worked up and the proverbial tiger is about to attack you, it's understandable that you're going to have a rush of adrenaline. Your heart is going to beat. Sometimes my nose, like my sinus is clear. That's when I know I'm a little bit like something just hit me really hard is when like I can breathe. It's like, oh shit, my brain just got the signal to calm or to like get really keyed up. You know, some animals shit and then run. Like, you know, if, but here's the thing. Did, is my rapid heart rate caused by anxiety?

And forgive me for the obviousness here, unless you spent 50 years not knowing this. the anxiety, quote unquote, that I have, did that cause my heart to beat faster? Or is it conceivable that when my heart is beating faster, it tends to cause anxiety? And if you don't see the difference, then you don't have my problem. Because here's the thing. If you find a way to calm your body, you can call it meditation. I mean, you could call that, whatever you want to call it, if you can find a way to exercise a little bit more control over the seemingly unbreakable link

between your physical body and your mind. I'm not saying brain here, but your mind. If you can find some way to, however you choose to parse that, have some executive function that allows you to control what's happening, what you're aware of, what is causing what, no matter how bullshit that concept is and whether it involves a fishing lure or like a clear body in orange liquid, if you can make your breathing slow down, you just, you're so much further along.

than you were a month ago. Whatever it takes to do that. You call it whatever the fuck you want. Is it headspace? Is it kneeling on rice? I don't fucking care. If you find, first of all, yeah, Zen. Zen does not mean chocolate. Zen means like, if you're talking about stuff like mindfulness meditation, it's the least relaxing thing that you will do this year. Yep. And that's the problem. The problem is for people like me, I thought I was doing it wrong when the problem was I was doing it too right.

AlexYes.

MerlinSo right because I was told it was going to be relaxing. And you know what? Mindfulness meditation, you know what you do a lot? You cry. And you don't cry because you're uncomfortable. You cry because there's something very profound happening at the moment that is very difficult to describe. Is that relaxation? Not really. You got to calm your mind a little bit. Got to bring them out in Muhammad. But I think just because something's not what it seems doesn't mean it's bullshit. If it gives you a hook, and for my case, in my junior year of high school, this put me more in touch with several things that I needed to know.

like that I didn't have to be unhappy all the time or that I didn't have to feel shitty about myself all the time, but also that there was a way for me to get some distance from what I was feeling. And that was kind of the prototypical beginning for me of, I want to be able to take an idea, have it not equal, equal me, and want to be able to hold it in my hands and turn it around and decide what I think about it and how I feel about it. And I want to be in control of that rather than feeling like for the rest of my life, my emotions that define me, that my problems equal who I am, that's the rest of my life,

and I have no way to control that. And if it takes a bullshit 34-minute self-hypnosis tape to help with that, I don't have a problem in the world with that.

AlexI am so happy that this came into your life at the time that you needed it. And I think that's my beef with all of this is it can help so much for the person who needs it but doesn't get into the like snake oily like seven like the the big the big one for me is always seven habits of

highly effective people and like oh fuck all of that like no please no one read that book uh and

MerlinIt's got a couple of very good plans. You don't think sharpening the saw is good? Ladder against the wrong wall? You don't like that?

AlexChallenge. I have a nut.

MerlinI don't know, buddy. I don't know.

AlexI'd get in trouble. But there's so many things.

MerlinIt doesn't require you to join what some people would call a cult. Something like, say, UCB. You don't have to take classes and move up and pay more and more in order to figure out who the fuck you are just a little bit.

AlexRight. This is no Nexium.

MerlinI'm obviously, I'm alighting the joke about holding soup cans in a subway station and then eventually starring in Mission Impossible. I'm avoiding that to say that no. And this is another problem with what, it's not a problem with religion. It's a problem with how people feel about people of faith. I choose all of those words by design, which is that, you know, hey, you know, just because this isn't your thing, that doesn't mean that person's stupid. It doesn't mean that person's gullible. And like what that person has gotten out of this, you go and talk to Ken Case, like First time I ever drove him around in a car with Ken Case and talked about his faith. I think a big part of, he is very much a man of faith, as is his family.

Oh, I didn't know that. He arrived there for the singing. He loves Bach. He loves Bach Chorale. He is a fantastic singer and has sung in groups his whole life. But the thing is, you could hear what I'm saying and not know what the fuck is going on in the world of Christianity. I think I'm just, I only have one example. It's like somebody talks about modern music and only knows talking heads or something. It might sound like, oh, singing in covered dishes. Singing in covered dishes are so fucking important. And if you don't know it, that's a goddamn shame. Singing in a group is fucking amazing.

Whether you're singing a guided by voices cover with a lot of beers or whether you are singing like in junior church, in my case. Like the power of a bunch of people singing in a room is profound. And you feel it in your body. It gives you shivers. I mean for a thing that's supposedly about this squirrely religion and the wizard in the sky lol like it's really fucking profound to sing a song around a fire at church camp it gives you feelings in like really profound ways it's you know and so I mean is that bullshit yeah I mean everything's

bullshit just something can be extremely helpful and even very important in your life like you know the things that you learned as a child is the fact that you learned those things as a child you know does that make them any less useful i mean if you learn the golden rule and still like to apply does that make you simple because that's a child's wisdom fuck you man like don't don't think everybody has to be as unhappy as you are person that's not the listener yeah over yeah

Alexwhat did i do this time i'm sorry i'm the person who cries now why you used to be the crier on this show uh you can tell you can tell you think this lady's catholic no definitely not because it's a lady wearing a wearing that uh oh wow see i'm a fake catholic i don't know what the dingus is called anymore the little uh white thing that pops out i don't oh it'll be in show notes she looks

Merlinlike somebody could really help a person understand their relationship with god in the world through

Alexsomething like say spanking yeah me uh do you have a number is that is something like where you like look it up is there like a directory no no the uh oh i was just crying about youth group uh but the because i agree and the number one thing i miss from from you know you know pandemic and quarantine is concerts like far in a way the most difficult thing for me has has been that

Merlinbecause that's the one place where i wish i wish this would go away and i could just walk somewhere and go see you of Montreal. Yeah. That's all. We'll just go back to whatever. I would just like to go see you of Montreal. I'm ready for that to happen.

AlexYeah, yeah. Anyway, my favorite part was the orange liquid because I never realized.

MerlinDid you like that? You imagine that there's like a cork and your body fills with an orange, warm orange liquid and you're a shining sun on your body parts. So it's a little... No, but what is that? That's fucking yoga. That's basically... That's basically... What do they call that? When you do... My wife knows this. It's the thing where your body, not body awareness, but where you're focusing your attention, guided relaxation? Is that what it's called?

AlexI don't know.

MerlinBut it's like the thing where you, like when you're a little kid, again, you say, okay, start, relax your toes, relax your feet, like da-da-da-da. It's that kind of thing. You're basically just becoming aware of your body. And in my case, this is the very first time I started realizing the places that I unintentionally carry muscle tension all of the time. until I realize it and stop for a second. And then guess what? 90 seconds later, I'm still doing it. I'm doing it again. Oh, sorry. Sorry. Youth group, youth group. Oh, spanky priest.

AlexSpanking. Well, one thing that I realized that never even occurred to me before is that the big hang up for not meditation, but for trying to, like there are specific kinds of mindfulness, like calm. the app column is actually i actually really like it um but they have i do too i do too is that the

Merlinone where they have like the the doesn't know like a stephen fry thing yeah there's the one of like the train ride through um europe or whatever yeah that's those are pretty good i like those yeah and

Alexand i uh but i never i meditating or practicing mindfulness is very difficult for it's difficult for everyone it's so fucking hard i never realized that part of the reason i could never do meditation that's supposed to um make make you uh if not more relaxed supposed to you know decrease anxiety is because what happens when you have a panic attack you feel for me at least uh it kind of feels like you're you can't breathe and you're having a heart attack so trying if anything you're

Merlinprobably too aware of your body and like over noticing things and well kind of it's when it's

Alexwhen it is specifically like breath work it is always like i come out of meditating more more anxious which in some cases is the goal you know oh my god alex i i so associate i so associate

Merlinmeditation with stress that because i only ever use it when i'm stressed out bad on me that now if i try to do controlled breathing i move the other direction if i'm sitting there at night with my oximeter on my finger like I do, it's amazing how I can watch my pulse and breath rate go up as I try to, quote unquote, relax. Instead, I need to unhook. I need to not over attach because I'm not meditating. I'm trying to relax. And can we please understand that there is such a huge fucking difference? You might need to relax in order to get into meditation and calm your body.

But meditation is not relaxation and relaxation does not have to be meditation. I think it's I think it fucks with people. I really think it fucks with people.

AlexI agree. And I will, well, actually you, because I fell into the productivity racket of reading, what's his name? Oh, the productivity project. I don't know. It was actually a pretty good book.

MerlinLike a famous one? Or not a famous one?

AlexOh, what is it?

MerlinIs it the guy from Hook?

AlexI don't know.

MerlinIs it the guy from, is it like a.

AlexHe's the Canadian.

MerlinIs somebody in our community or is it like a David Allen?

AlexNo, he's a – oh, the productivity project by Chris Bailey. And he has this thing on Audible called How to Train Your Mind, which you think is like bullshit. But it was like an hour and it's about mindfulness. But he specifically talks about how like, hey, meditation isn't going to necessarily – like you are not going to be relaxed while you do this type of meditation. And we like there are different. He says what like certain kinds of meditation is like he's like, OK, we're going to focus on mindfulness.

But there are different practices. So we just, I think, need different names for it because.

MerlinDifferent names, but also a more a more muscular explanation of what you can expect out of this.

AlexYeah. And the whole thing with the liquid.

MerlinIf you think day zero or day one of your Buddhism is going to give you Satori, like, well, first of all, your motivations might be a little off, if I could say. But, like, you know, if instead we say, like, you know, it's going to be more like working out. It's really a lot more like working out than going to church.

AlexYeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And but this tape, I don't – it's not – well, it's not self-hypnosis, but it is – it's something. And now, actually, when I am using Calm, it's like, be aware of your breath. And I'm just like, my breath is orange liquid.

MerlinStop talking to me like this. I sound like I'm strapped to a table. Could you please stop talking to me like this?

AlexGod, it's well, another thing that...

MerlinI feel like I'm on a 72-hour hold and I can't turn the speaker off. Also, I've come across, literally, no, I've come across the church statues of female saints in the after show. Alex and I will be going over the statues and deciding who is the hottest female saint depicted in statuary.

AlexOh, do you have a, do you have, are there any?

MerlinYou're talking about something like a uniform resource link like that? Hot saints. Coming up soon.

AlexHot saints.

MerlinHot saints.

AlexOh, Dorothy. Well, Dorothy. I'm like, I wouldn't ever be a saint because she was a socialist and I don't like that.

MerlinSome of these modern ones. Look at this Saint Gianna Beretta Mola. Oh, she likes kids. That's cool. Mother Teresa. So many mothers. So many mothers, Teresa.

AlexOh, my gosh. Well, she is problematic now.

MerlinOh, you know who's hot? You know who's hot is the lady in the Joan of Arc movie, the French Joan of Arc movie.

AlexI've never seen that.

MerlinDid you ever see that back in the day? The silent, it's not Romoir. Who did it? Jean-Marc?

AlexI have.

MerlinAnd we will also decide which one of these female saints most likes spanking. Give us your fucking money.com.

Show notes

Transcript

226. Penis Lawyers

Show notes

Transcript

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